I'm Julie, and I live with my husband and three young daughters in New South Wales suburbia, Australia. This is the online journal I kept until recently, of how we are trying to live more simply & sustainably in suburbia.

This blog is on indefinite hiatus but please feel free to look around my archives for some inspiration in your own journey to living more lightly and sustainably.


Thursday, October 02, 2008

Answering a Question

Sorry, there's no pics, craft or cooking in this post, just lots of my opinion on urban sustainability issues LOL. Feel free to skip to the next post if this isn't your 'thing' :-)


I recently received the following email recently from a reader:

"Bravo Crazy Mumma! I applaud your endeavour..... I am 1000% behind the concept of personal sustainability. However, if 1c is taken from the public purse to support such a proposition, it is un-sustainable! What is _truly_ sustainable? If we all did it (successfully), where would the money come from to pay for the upkeep of our (current) society. Clean drinking water to tap, sewerage treatment, street lights, hospitals, police force, road management, schooling, pensions for the sick, old or incompetent.......etc. etc. Is this proposed lifestyle "sustainable"? Maybe! Possibly you have thought of measures to accommodate such needs. I am keen to understand.

I am held back by the thought that, as a top level taxpayer who would love the opportunity to become independent and self sufficient, if I did it at anyone else's expense wouldn't it would be fraudulent? Unless, of course, my intention was anarchistic/the total annihilation of current societal systems?

I am keen to understand how people view what is truly sustainable vs selfish existence at others expense..... Do you have a comment to make on this issue - that you would be happy to make public? "

*****

In answer to your question D, firstly I think you are making a number of assumptions, the most significant of which, in my opinion, is the assumption that sustainability = self-sufficiency.

Whilst there is a sector of the Peak Oil-aware community who believe that we should head for the hills and create our own completely self-sufficient "lifeboats" complete with guns and ammunition to fend off the hungry hordes (the so-called "survivalists"), I am not one of them.

It's my belief that whilst complete self-sufficiency is a nice ideal, in practice it is unrealistic - and I believe unnecessary - for everyone to be able to provide for everything they need (notice I say 'needs' not 'wants').

Humans are very much social creatures which is part of the reason that we formed small villages when we became able to domesticate animals and farm food. In those villages, bartering and the exchange of goods and services was the norm, and self-sufficiency was the exception; farmers sold produce in order to buy fabric or sugar, and have their horses shod by a farrier for example. I see no reason why a modern version of this type of system couldn't function successfully in a future where oil and fuel are no longer freely or cheaply available, even (particularly?) in suburban areas with larger backyards and enough room for a vegie patch or a workshop.

Food is a huge part of our lives - the growing of it and the customs surrounding eating it - and so it is natural that when we socialise much of it revolves around food. In the sustainable society that I envisage, this would involve the local sharing of food (and other) resources through bartering and exchange as well. For example, you keep chickens in your backyard, but I grow fabulous tomatoes, so we agree to swap my tomato sauce for your eggs. Or my next door neighbour might be a talented seamstress so I swap her fresh tomatoes for some clothes mending. My examples are simplistic perhaps, but I believe that this kind of system is entirely workable, and in this way we won't each need 10 acres to provide all of our needs. We will however, need to acquire or brush up on some 'old' skills like food preservation even if we aren't actually growing the food ourselves.

In the same way, we might exchange services, such as the LETS (local energy trading systems) organisations around Australia already do now. For example I might offer to babysit the neighbour's children in exchange for a hair cut. In addition, in the near future as oil becomes more and more expensive, I hope to see a resurgence in the old corner shop and local suburban strip-shopping (with locally owned and run businesses providing services such as a butcher, baker, fruit and veg, haberdashery, tailor, doctor etc) to replace the huge 'malls' that designed around car travel. There are many communities around the world including in Australia, who have set up "relocalisation" networks (based on the fantastic U.K. 'Transition Towns' concept) with the aim to promote and facilitate this very thing, amongst other aims.

Your first assumption then flows into your second assumption, that a sustainable lifestyle = not paying taxes.

As I've said previously, I don't believe that complete self-sufficiency is necessary, or even desirable in many ways. Providing for every single thing your family requires is an exhausting and onerous proposition, and one that I am not currently prepared to take on even if we won the lottery and could afford to move to a 100 acre piece of land. More importantly, even if we did move - and decided to try the complete self-sufficiency thing - we would still be paying rates on our piece of land (a tax). Initially it would be unlikely that my husband would give up work completely, so we would still be paying some income tax, and in addition we would be paying GST on any number of supplies that we would need in order to set up and maintain a property that we could have little to no chance of manufacturing ourselves: fencing materials, building materials, water tanks, concrete, gardening implements such as hoes and rakes, piping for water and greywater; the list goes on and on. Whether or not many of these resources will continue to be available (as freely) in the future as the price of oil continues to skyrocket is debatable, however I'd suggest that when that happens, governments will have little choice but to divert taxes away from areas such as building motorways and ring roads anyway.

As you've suggested, taxes form an integral part of the way that services such as health care and law enforcement are provided. I am a huge cynic by nature and strongly feel that where/when taxes become harder to collect in one area they will be added on in other areas to make up the shortfall. I have already seen evidence of the ways in which the Australian federal and state governments are considering (or have already implemented) ways of introducing or raising taxes aimed at those people trying to live more sustainably; notably the much-discussed introduction of charging for rainwater collected on urban properties (there are already limits on the amount of water you are able to store on rural properties e.g. the size of any dam/s). How authorities would even begin to assess and charge for rain water I have no idea, but where there is a will there's a way, as they say.

Which leads me to your third assumption, that our current municipal utilities system, providing "Clean drinking water to tap, sewerage treatment, street lights, hospitals, police force, road management, schooling, pensions for the sick, old or incompetent" is working efficiently and sustainably.

I have issues with the ways that many of these services are being provided, particularly the provision of water. I believe that the current energy-intensive system of extensively treating all of the water provided to households and businesses to such a high standard is unnecessary and wasteful. We don't need chlorinated water for our gardens or for washing the car for example, and neither do many of the businesses and manufacturers who use municipal water in their processes.

Whilst providing and then retrofitting different quality water supplies and piping to existing houses and many businesses is unrealistic, the provision of rainwater tanks for these purposes is not. Indeed, I believe that the extensive use of rainwater tanks for both domestic and business purposes would dramatically ease the demands on our water supply systems, saving both water and energy (through the reduced use of treatment chemicals and the reduced volume of water being pumped around the city), and therefore the dollars we pay for the provision of this service would then stretch much further.

Plus, as a side effect, the reduced water usage and the reuse of greywater would also reduce the load on our sewerage systems and the treatment of sewage, again, saving energy and resources. It's madness that so much of our highly-treated water is used once - for purposes other than drinking - and then goes straight into the wastewater system! We urgently need to assess the way water in general is used in Australia, actually.

As for the provision and maintenance of street lights and roads, again I think the current system is unsustainable. Instead of looking at short term solutions to traffic congestion for example, if our taxes were being used to build dedicated, safe bike path systems and improve public transport, the reduced traffic would mean that less money would have to be spent on maintenance of the current roads. In another example, if Council planners were to demand that new residential subdivisions have adequate access to public transport and insist that there must be a corner store and doctor within walking distance, what a saving in road usage that would make, with no expense required by the Council! I could go on with examples in that fashion all day.

Finally, as I pointed out previously, I don't think that living sustainably means not paying any taxes, therefore I feel that with a long-term plan in mind (not the current short term, I-have-to-get-re-elected-next-year plans) there can still be adequate income for the provision of health and social services such as hospitals, schools and law enforcement.

Lastly, you mention a "selfish existence at others expense". Whilst there are many people who could happily live in isolation and complete self-sufficiency, never seeing another soul, I think that the majority of us seek out some level of community interaction, and I feel that a sustainable future is very much going to be based around local communities. In this way I see the exact opposite of our current society - wherein people have no idea who their neighbours are and elderly folks can die in their unit and not be noticed missing for months - evolving (returning). We are so de-personalised as a society at the moment, sitting in our little commuter car-bubbles, texting and emailing each other, cocooning ourselves in our surround-sound home theatres of a night, instead of actually interacting with other people. In a sustainable future I see a much more close knit community, not a collection of selfish individuals; surely that is what we are right now!

Anyway, I could blather on about these issues all day and I've only touched very lightly on most of them, but I hope that this gives you some idea of what living sustainably (in suburbia) means to me :-)

32 comments:

Kez said...

Excellent post Julie! How ya feeling?

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Kez,
Thanks mate. It doesn't take much energy to sit in front of a computer so here I am "bludging" and taking it easy LOL ;-) Unfortunately it also means a bigger grocery shop since I - theroretically - should be baking more crackers etc as the kids have nothing but fruit to eat (poor neglected children LOL).

Cheers, Julie

Tammy James said...

I love your response to this question and you give me a lot to consider.
We live in the suburbs. Last Summer and into the start of winter our neighbour shared his veggie crop with us and other neighbors! as Spring approached we gave him MOUNDS of dry cut grass to mulch his beds with...
A very small example of one mans trash being another's treasure and also of the community exchange you talk about here.

Melinda said...

Great post! Thanks!

Busy Woman said...

Excellent Response Julie.

Sometimes I think the term 'self sufficient' is confusing and has a different meaning in each culture.

I think what we are aiming for in terms of sustainable living is a co-operative model, not an 'every man for themselves' model.

I read someone recently raving about netflix ( subscribed DVD service by mail) because it cut down the 'emissions' caused when driving to the local video store. It suddenly occured to me, "i'd hate to be the owner of the small local video store".

When we think 'sustainable' we also have to consider our community and support local businesses and tradespeople who, yes, pay their taxes and in return provide us with street lighting!!!

You and I are not about cutting ourselves off from society - we are about embracing it and making changes from the inside. The best way to produce a more sustainable community is to start in our own backyards and teach our children well!! and you, my friend...... are doing a fantastic job at that!

emmani said...

You've got my vote Julie!

You have even answered a few of the issues I couldn't quite get my head around, I have even changed my blog description from 'self sufficiency' to 'sustainability', because like you I am not looking to be 100% self sufficient, but I do want to leave the smallest footprint possible on this planet when I leave and teach my daughter to follow my footsteps to do the same for our future generations...

It's sometimes hard to explain what we are aiming for, we know the way, but can't give directions...

Lizzie said...

Good response.
It never occurred to me that sustainability = dont pay taxes. Do we know where the original questioner came from to have such a unusual view?
In the UK Sustainable Communities is top of the political agenda (eclipsed a bit by the economy falling to bits obviously) although you wouldnt always know it from the behaviour of some local councils.
Is there a future in the unsustainable? Well, no, not really, thats the whole point. Its unsustainable!

greenfumb said...

Well said. We too are working towards a more sustainable life style but still working in the community and paying taxes. In Australia they would tax the air you breathe if they could get away with it.

We too swap veges with our neighbours although I am reluctant to do it too much as they don't always share my passion for organic methods.

If we all shopped locally and used local trades people the only ones who would suffer would be big multinationals whose CEO's salaries could fund governments in third world countries. Dont get me started.

Anyway I was very impressed with your response.
Keep up the good work.

Gavin said...

Here, Here, Julie. Great response.

I too find that many people I meet confuse the hard core survivalist, with the suburban sustainable-living family. Totally different ends of the spectrum as far as I am concerned. I love sharing, whereas the gun toting survivalist are protectionists.

Building a sense of community in this otherwise senseless, wasteful society we live in is the best goal anyone can aim for.

Gav

jacqui jones said...

interesting post
great answers...some i wouldnt of thought of
we r moving towards sustainability in our family, it included the purchase of a house, a dream of sorts...we still paid all the taxes involved in that purchase...we then will pay our rates and my dh's tax bill (cause he is a work a holic who had his holidays paid out!!! lesson learnt for him)plus the general gst on everything i have purchased like everyone else...taxes i know here r well and truely still paid for!

i look forward to swapping things with my neighbours..esp anyone with chickens! (im not a bird person at all and jsut cant do the chicken thing)

as a sahm my community benefit from that three fold. community groups in my town are run by sahm's and retired women! i am however lucky enough to live in a small town with local owned business from the supermarket to the butcher...i love supporting my locals...i think the growing of some of our own food allows me a little extra in the food budget to keep the spending local

on a totally side note...can u lead me to any cracker recipes...im using your lavash bread crackers, we just dont want to get sick of them

Shel said...

Bravo Julie, bravo.

Em said...

What a thought provoking topic - have to say that I'd not ever considered sustainable living as being selfish. Thankyou for taking the time to reply and post here Julie!

IMO paying tax is not the only way to contribute to a healthy community and country. Tax is certainly a very visible measure of a person's contribution, but who measures the value of the time and skills contributed by volunteers? Who measures the value of healthy land and soil, generated by backyard organic gardeners? I could go on. There are many ways to contribute :)

Cassie said...

As a long-time lurker on your blog, I had to leave some applause for your wonderful set of arguments. Some of which, like other readers, I certainly couldn't have articulated quite so well. I like the terms sustainable and also living simply. Leaving the material craziness of this world and focusing on the more important things. Doesn't mean I'll never shop again, I'll just think twice about what I'm buying.

Keep up the fabulous work!

daisymum7 said...

Lucky I went back and read the rest of your post before I posted my initial tirade on the whole sewerage/sewage thing.



daisymum

Linda said...

I came here to comment but having read all the other comments here there is nothing much left to say except - Good on ya girl, I'm with you - I support your line of thinking and enjoy your blog. Keep up the good work Linda :)

MrsG said...

I don’t comment much but really enjoy reading your blog and just had to say how brilliant this post is! I wholeheartedly agree with what you've written and I’m not sure I would have been able to write it so succinctly. Thank you for putting it in to words. It’s great to know that, although the people in my life don’t always get where I’m coming from, there are loads of folks out there with the same ideas on life, living and community!

June Saville said...

Well done on this post Julie. It's so important to encourage people to stop and really look at the possibilities with sustainability. And what it can really mean.
Again, I draw your attention to the Currumbin Eco Village on the Gold Coast Queensland Australia.
They've just won world’s finest example of sustainable urban development and best residential subdivision, awarded in Amsterdam.
As I mentioned in a previous comment, my daughter and son-in-law are about to move in and it's really an exciting community that is showing the way as a possibility for the future.
Check out http://www.theecovillage.com.au and a story with pix that I did on my blog www.journeysincreativewriting.blogspot.com
for more details.
It's hard yards to lead the way, but the people living at/or striving to be residents are a determined bunch, and they need to be! As you must know!

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Tammy,
Yes, your exchanges with your neighbour are great not only because you are both getting something you want, but you are also building a relationship with people you might need to call on in the future, or might have some valuable skills to share. It's good all 'round!

Hi Melinda,
I'm glad you found it useful :-)

Hi M,
You are so right, what we are doing is all about (re)building communities. I was so sad recently when my local health food shop closed due to slow business. I can understand why when it was more expensive than buying online but I preferred to see my money going locally, not to mention the valuable information I could get by chatting with the owner :-(

Cheers, Julie

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Emma,
Thank you :-) I'm so glad you were able to get something useful from my ramblings LOL.

Hi Lizzie,
No I've no idea where the questioner came from, but I can kind of understand where someone might think like that - the whole sustainability thing can be quite confusing I think, especially to people new to the concept?

Hi greenfumb,
Thank you :-) I love to support local businesses too, although in the current financial climate I can understand why many people can't see any reason to spend more on a locally-produced product when they can buy a fully-imported product for half the price. Which is why the local businesses can't compete and go out of business. Sigh.

Cheers, Julie

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Gavin,
Yes the survivalist image is one I come across all the time when I talk to people sadly, and as you say, the average family just can't relate to that at all. That's where the importance of community-building comes in, and why your blog is so popular :-)

Hi Jacqui,
Yes mate, I'll get back to you with some links for cracker recipes when I find them! They're on this 'puter somewhere LOL.

Hi Shel,
Thanks :-)

Cheers, Julie

Nicole said...

very well written Julie :o)

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Em,
No of course paying taxes isn't the only way to contribute to a healthy community - however the person who asked the question was worried that public hospitals and schools will suffer from a lack of funding.

Hi Cassie,
That's it, isn't it - living simply doesn't necessarily mean not spending anything, but it does mean that careful thought goes into what our income is spent on.

Hi daisymum,
I'm sorry that I have upset you for some reason, I have emailed you an apology.

Cheers, Julie

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Linda,
Thank you :-)

Hi Mrsg,
Thank you, I'm glad I'm making sense! Like you, I am often considered a bit 'odd' in my real life community, but it's my hope that people will remember me for that when they are ready for advice or need some help?

Hi June,
The eco-development looks lovely and I like the concept, but it's certainly not something that the average family can afford. A couple of years ago I too would have raved about this type development, but now I look at the number of families who are going to be severely affected by climate change and the end of cheap oil, and I wonder who is going to help them get through it? Certainly not those living in the new eco-communities with their smart-wired houses and lap pools. I'm sorry for sounding so cynical, but these developments seem very elitist to me.

Hi Nicole,
Thank you :-)

Cheers, Julie

emmani said...

I didn't get the feeling that Daisymum was upset with you Julie, but that she was going to go in the the differences between sewage and sewerage in her comment. She then realised you had already cleared it up (not literally!) in your post for the courtesy of your anonymous emailer...

I don't think any sane person could disagree or get angry with you over this one.... even D him/herself!

Em said...

Hi Julie, just wanted to come back to say how well I thought you discussed the topic in this post - I didn't mean my comment to sound like it was directed at your answer; you write so clearly and thoughtfully. xxx

Sarah said...

WOO HOO

Well said!

I think everyone ha covered it well.

Gladstone Greenie said...

Hi all.
just discovered this blog. I am trying to do the same thing - live sustainably in suburbia. It can be done!
I live in Gladstone Qld, and initially I was looking for info on growing water chestnuts as i just got my first plant. I am going to use a richer soil mix than i had planned, and a bigger container.
Anyway, thanks for your blog julie, I'll look forard to reading future posts.
Anna

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Anna,
Thanks for stopping by and leaving a comment :-) I'm so glad you've found a useful post - good luck with your water chestnuts! I'm certainly hoping for a better harvest this year, so I will be adding much more fertiliser.

Cheers, Julie

Crazy Mumma said...

Hi Emma,
Yes you are probably right, I'm just being paranoid!

Hi Em,
I'm sorry I made you feel paranoid! It wasn't you, so please don't stop leaving comments here :-)


Hi Sarah,
Thanks :-)

Cheers, Julie

daisymum7 said...

Oh no you didn't upset me - I was just saying that I picked up on the grammatical error and I got all fired up and wrote a comment about it to your poster then I read your whole answer and realised you had succinctly addressed it yourself. Please forgive me I was very tired when I wrote that and I mustn't have worded it correctly.

I agree wholeheartedly with everything you wote there is nothing more important than rebuilding our communites, and treading more lightly on this planet.

Oh please say it wasn't my comment that made you feel Blerk!

daisymum

June Saville said...

Hi again Julie
I absolutely understand your concern for families of the future.
It is true that the Currumbin Eco Village was planned in more plentiful times and that people who are now going into it are horrified at the task ahead.
In fact the villagers have set up a committee to find ways of helping people who are having problems.
The idea was to have a community of families with a wide spread of economic circumstances and that is proving difficult now.
The problem is that the costs must be borne up front, with benefits following in time. Costs of buying solar panels, staying independent of public water, recycling grey water, monitoring power use etc add quite a percentage to the cost of building, even though they're only small houses.
Those who bought their land three years ago will continue to have a battle until their houses are complete.
However, people there already are beginning to see benefits of working together as a community on this, with power bills of $20 buoying them along.
They also have the knowledge that they are not a drain on the public water supply AT ALL and can and do make a contribution to the electricity grid.
They are pressing ahead as a community aiding each other and using technology to help them do it. Their dream is to demonstrate what can be done.
Julie we must face the fact that families with both partners working do not have the time for a lot of the stuff you can do.
We must all come to this great task from different perspectives and make a contribution where we can.
Like it or not the Eco Village is doing a lot to show what can be done in a community of 150 families.
You might be right that the last remaining bit of land will be difficult to afford. But it is simply not fair to paint these hard working people there now as simply a mob of yuppies. Because they're not!
Eighty per cent of the land will be used for production of food forests etc.to reduce body corporate costs.
There is a hall for meetings and social occasions and one community lap pool, but what's wrong with that? The basis of this is COMMUNITY and not trying to solve problems on your own. Much more efficient, surely.
Not every eco community is the same of course, with some a bit of a sham.
That's why it's important to look closely at individual cases. Then we are not in danger of throwing the baby out with the bath water.
June - also in Oz

June Saville said...

Thanks for your email Julie. I am quite sure we agree on the fundamentals. Village codes include most of the matters you speak about.
As I said in my previous post 'We must all come to this great task from different perspectives and make a contribution where we can.'
I was speaking to my daughter about our conversation and I do wish to pass on a big point she made.
Everyone building houses at the moment is having a battle with rising prices, not just for sustainable ones.
Sustainable items on each house at the village are often available at reduced prices because of the village purchasing plans. Owners are sharing knowledge and helping each other.
Although Currumbin Eco Village codes mean extra cost that's a price families knowingly accept in the cause of demonstrating another way to meet the challenges. They know it will be difficult.
They are producing valuable material being used globally for research on sustainable housing. This work has been going on for 13 years - ten years before the first shovel arrived on the village itself.
Many heads are better than one eh?
Cheers
June

LinkWithin

Related Posts Plugin for WordPress, Blogger...